I am heartened to see students posting lengthy and some well-considered commentaries. Differentiation is necessary for CAP purposes, and for Honours classification, and these are here to stay for the foreseeable future. The current error implies that there are 55% of the students obtaining a B+, B or B- grade. In normal cases, no one will satisfy with a low grade. I believe most if not all students have been affected by it one way or another. Is it justifiable for us to change for the environment or do you think that it is better for the environment to change for its students? The Bell Curve God usually sleeps in NUS or NTU residences, and is usually woken during recess week, where desperate university students seek answers. Take an example of a module enrolling 1,500 students, e.g., a foundational maths module for engineering students, co-taught in 5 sections (of about 300) by 5 professors. In addition, the fact that the NUS Administration “does not like” the idea that students are paying customers, does not change the fact that they are. A lot of the content covered in LSM1401 is really H2 Biology material, and we not only took that subject (that would have been bad enough for balance), but in addition, almost every single one of us aced it, because it is a matriculation requirement for us. This is not to say that there will be people who are the best in everything all the time; generally speaking the top people per module change with the module. Sincere thanks, The bell curve is used primarily as a tool to moderate grades, and as a guide to prevent grade inflation or deflation. Thanks for alerting us on the computation and we’ve adjusted it! In terms of a cost/benefit kind of ratio, this approach is superior to the current system from our (students’) point of view, and doesn’t bring with it as many drawbacks for the lecturers as full result disclosure might bring. The exam is a blunt instrument to evaluate learning, and the bell curve mitigates some of the disparity introduced by exams. This means that if you are smart, that’s good, but if you’re smarter, that’s awesome. The average mark was 83 for a class of 630. Topic: Humble perspective on problems surfacing if exam papers are released. 4. You do have points on a current lack of transparency that I agree with however. Does it mean that if I have a cap well above 4.5 but a B+ for thesis/fyp, i am not considered a first class student? I have come out with 4 points that show why bell curve is unnecessary. I hope not. For smaller classes, Professors are given discretion on an appropriate grade distribution because small sets of data may not be normally distributed. Given that most students probably would not go into research after their graduation, i find that requirement irrelevant. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. The bell curve is used as a guide in a class of "reasonable size", referring to 20 or more students, in the following manner: 20 per cent to 25 per cent to get A+, A or A-; 35 per cent to 40 per cent to get B+ or B; 35 per cent to 40 per cent to get B-, C+ or … Hi, there is an error in the computed GPA. I believe such scenario is quite common for some of the modules in NUS. #25: I felt Garrett could have been more diplomatic in putting his points across. Carelessly branding all of Singapore as “selfish” just signifies to the interlocutor that the person speaking is emotional and not in a constructive frame of mind. I humbly propose that NUS should have a letter explaining its bell curve, to help NUS students applying for graduate schools in the US/UK. Creating a perfect system is one thing, eradicating old system is another. Do not worry too much, more often than not, we err on helping students along. This was discussed, and one of our concerns was that our students may base their evaluation on the perceived level of difficulty of the exam or their perceived performance during the exam. But if you want to be picky, for some papers indeed nobody is truly qualified to mark the papers. For papers along the lines of a more subjective basis like history or philosophy, even a full professor may never be fully qualified to mark the paper, since ultimately an objective, or highly consensus based view may not be present. Due to the fact that some lecturers “recycle” their midterm/exam/homework questions, having the solution of an exam passed down by a senior is extremely beneficial to a “junior”, to the extent that I can say it is “almost unfair” to someone who has no “senior”. I would like to know how large a sample size should be for the normal distribution to be considered applicable. In order that my future junior can enjoy learning, I do wish that the university can consider revamping the system. Would you mind elaborating why so? I believe this is setting students back in the working world, where employers may not understand the technicalities between the degree classifications in the various university. A bell curve is a graph depicting the normal distribution, which has a shape reminiscent of a bell. Perhaps, some time in the future, an NUS graduate can change the world! Once every three years, a pair of colleagues will sit in on classes and provide an assessment of the teaching. Effective with the September 2008 graduating class, the GPA cutoffs for each category are determined by the combined GPA distribution from the preceding academic year, all graduation moments included. We currently feel quite wronged and would appreciate any information on how such a grading system is deemed appropriate in this case. Singapore Management Univer-sity (SMU) then provost Professor Kong revealed that the “Bell Jack also proposed shifting the module evaluation (by students) till after the exams. Political agenda aside, this story is very interesting. I forgot to add, most likely your final exam papers are graded by the grad students (esp Science, Com and Engineering course with class >100), and not by professors themselves. Required fields are marked *. For instance, if a lot of students report that they found the exam easy but for some odd reason their scores prior to grade assignment were low, that could signal a serious conceptual error that must be addressed. “NUS adopts a ‘recommended grade distribution’”, an example of the moderation can be seen image shown below. Would it be possible not to reveal the weightage/percentage of the assignments, projects and examinations for a particular module? What do you think about scoring students against the bell curve from the previous year’s results? The bell curve is VERY, VERY STEEP and 1% can make all the difference in your A and B. Firstly, you have mentioned that it gave motivation for student to study a subject, but so does the percentile system. I’m a teacher-to-be so this really bothers me. We do not apply the bell curve mindlessly or excessively. Finals was a completely different monster. You need to be really careful with reading the questions and its options, and not to over think. So this again shows that bell curve is unnecessary to be used for honour and CAP system. I do think that quantitative modules, e.g., Science and Technology modules, are easier to handle through exams. In that case, I advocate that bell curve is unnecessary in grading system, because bell curve system do not complement the effectiveness of learning. Can there be special consideration for those with learning difficulties, like a special one to one consultation with the lecturers and more assessment time for quizzes and exams? The scripts are then checked for unmarked pages and the marks are also carefully checked before they are entered into a mark sheet. To me, honour system complements on how to differentiate the effectiveness of how the person understands his/her subject, people who retain the highest level of understanding can get first honour grade. As I have emphasized in my blog article, we are not fixated in enforcing the grade distribution for every module (those with enrolment of more than 30). What I would think is 100% beneficial, is for lecturers to at least release a partial solution of selected questions, so that we learn how to solve the problems. We do monitor teaching performance. To me CAP system has no meaning except in creating a competition among students and actually not reflecting the students knowledge turning to percentage. I will be very disappointed to have students pull stunts such as “teaching” wrong things to classmates to get themselves on the right side of the bell curve. In your comments you spoke positively about many overseas universities – rest assured that we reference the best practices from many universities in the world, and I myself have had the privilege that you also had to experience these systems first-hand. This suggests that students may not always know what they need. If there are cases of bad teaching, do alert us. but if we do, then what grade does the 25 / 50 / … which is approximately 3.34, or roughly B grade. 1. In the next scenario, the resulting cut-off marks for each grade after moderation, are moderate. #10: Let me explain how grading for a large-enrolment module is done. P2:12 Openly engaging the institution you are ostensibly trying to change in a hostile manner is unlikely to produce the desired result of change. How can meaningful progress be made in such a situation? In your latest comment you ended in a despairing, almost derogatory manner – “Alas, one must always temper one’s expectation, after all this is NUS”. Whether or not the bell curve is instituted, not everyone would get an A anyway. The NUS administration also does not operate in a “we know what’s best for you” way; this blog project is in fact a portal through which I can interact directly with students and get direct feedback on what’s best for you! In the second half of the year, when the other half of the cohort took it under a different professor, almost everybody did well; possibly due to lenient grading by the professor, but also with great deviation from bell curve. However, the necessary rivalry that would allow this to happen does exist. P2:6 Do these honours students cover tutorials for said modules, or are these outside of formal class instruction time? I am from the business school and would like to understand why the classification of first class honours is dependent on not just CAP but also a thesis component. Diplomacy isn’t a matter of just being nice. These are some of the issues which we had debated on. We are at equilibrium right now, and working towards more effective teaching through smaller groups. #P1:35 There are differences in the A level subjects we took to take the certificate, though, even though we all get an equivalent level certificate. Also not revealing the scores in indvidual sub assessment of a module will result in insufficient information with student there by unable to realize what went wrong in modules where student not performed. http://www.alfiekohn.org/teaching/fdtd-g.htm. The table is for illustrative purposes Cheers.\. Kim: Photo credits: Rentafridge. And for the NUS examination system to be fair, allowing students to see their graded papers is indeed necessary, even if they are not returned to them but kept by NUS after the reviewing. Our colleagues have just completed an in-depth study on student feedback, and I could share some of the key ingredients and recommendations with you. Departments have 3 to 5 days after the exams to send the grades. I chanced upon this blog while looking for an official NUS policy statement about bell curves, and was very pleasantly surprised with the open discussions about many sensitive issues. #7: Your attitude is right! are they graded on the same curve as the others too? This are just some analysis of the effects of returning exams, from a students point of view, to provide a balanced argument. After establishing the importance of CAP, it does not mean that everyone should be choosing modules based on the ease to get good grades. Today is the last day of recess week. I must emphasize that the recommended grade distribution is not applied blindly, and there are ample opportunities, within reason, for discretion and flexibility. However, there is no perfect instrument, especially, when we need to apply to thousands of students. Getting a CAP of 3.5/5 (equivalent to GPA of 2.8) is very common due to bell-curve and grade deflation. Foreign universities accepting NUS students do not make exams more difficult for them because they are used to a more stringent system. #11: Dear Douglas, I am not convinced that it is easier to score an A in an arts module compared with a Science and Technology module. #6: Grading aside, one of the best way to learn is to teach. For example, Princeton has a grading policy letter (http://www.princeton.edu/career/undergrads/resumes/grading-policy-letter/gradingpolicyletter.pdf), explaining: “In 2004, the Princeton University faculty adopted new institutional grading expectations to address locally the national problem of grade inflation. Many students from US schools will have close to perfect GPAs, graduating summa cum laude, be in Phi Beta Kappa, or something like that. For modules which have some form of objective detail, or at least a high consensus in a particular way of thinking (particularly Mathematics modules), the marker has no effect on the paper. #21: The difficulty level of a module, as perceived by students, depends on several factors: teaching effectiveness of the professor, materials presented, grading, etc. Your suggestion, despite being crafted in mathematical language, is essentially to allow a high proportion of As for smaller classes. The Grade Free Scheme allows students to explore and attempt different things and different modules. Unfortunately, with or without the bell curve, it is never ideal. #18: It is true that NUS has expanded (in student enrolment) quite rapidly over the last 10 years. Example of a Recommended Grade Distribution: One could compute the average grade point: (5 x 0.17 + 4.5 x 0.08 + 4 x 0.14 + 3.5 x 0.13 + 3 x 0.13 + 2.5 x 0.15 + 2 x 0.15 + 1 x 0.05). For a university with the scale of NUS (i.e., 25,000 undergraduate students), it is impractical to speak of such an idealized situation. #8: David speaks of an idealized situation, perhaps achievable in a small setting, for instance, in a liberal arts university (i.e., about 4,000 to 5,000 students in total). Hell, I don’t. While we do make every effort to make sure modules are designed with clear learning outcomes, and professors are responsible to ensure their exams are pitched at the right level, grade moderation will prevent grade inflation or deflation, and helps to achieve consistency in assessment grading across modules. You could say in that case that no one is qualified to mark exam papers. This trains you to be more judicious about priority setting and time management between Hall life, CCAs, activities beyond university and studies. (Am I the only undergrad reading PhD comics?). NUS has no place for such selfish students! I believe just last year, only 22 students graduated from NUS business school with a first class honours whereas a greater proportion did so in NTU. 2. Hi there, so i heard cs1231 and cs1231s are the same, just that 1231s is only for CS students so no need same bellcurve. And in the event that everyone is first honour graduate and is able to show their outstanding capability at work, that will greatly improve the reputation of the university. “The most destructive form of grading by far is that which is done “on a curve,” such that the number of top grades is artificially limited: no matter how well all the students do, not all of them can get an A. But if the benefits of something new outweigh the costs of changing from the old, we should not dismiss it just like that. For promotions, a candidate will need two sets of independent peer review assessments. But certainly NUS should follow the policy that other good universities practise, which is to allow students to review their examination papers the next semester, so that they can learn from their mistakes. In order for the counterargument to take hold, it requires acceptance of the premiss that “there will be a chance that everyone in a batch for a module will be so good that they will all deserve to get an A”. FYI, my other group mates scored C, D+, D+ respectively. Even with successful implementation of the best system thought of, who knows really how good is it? In my humble opinion, this could allow for a more straightforward in the analysis of consistency throughout the duration of the course. Students are sometimes worried about falling on a ‘wrong side’ of the bell curve. D: My friends call me foolish, because I take a variety of modules across faculties. In terms of practical effectiveness, you should attempt to maximise the chance of being understood, or having a change made, if you wish to do those things. I feel like it’s a frivolous luxury – I do well enough, but I can’t gamble away my hard work on something I’m interesting and passionate about because it will hurt my CAP. But I don't really understand how the F happened considering that I spent the most time on this module but scored the worst. In addition, one component of teaching evaluation is based on peer reviews. #20: I think Patrick’s view of how a university should be run is overly simplistic. Should I try to learn under the fierce professor, or the lenient one? Do you agree? #10: Alex thought that it is unfair to subject exchange students to our high standards. I agree with Douglas and MJ on their views regarding the classification of first class honours. After all, the grapevine is the grapevine. Hey Dr Tan, I just came across a very interesting article on how a few professors in MIT decided to reform their grading system. Posters, oral presentations, interviews are all continuous assessments used more and more by our professors. #17: Dear Patrick, I do not agree that Computer Engineering students are disadvantaged. At the end of the semester, a student is awarded a grade (and not specific marks) for each course taken. Most if not all major universities have variants of degree classes or GPA scores. Just seeking your views on this, though it may not be related to this topic at all. But then without that system, employers would also have an even greater headache sorting through potential applicants for positions. #2: There is wisdom in what D had written, but sometimes, a person can change the world. The time constraint is to ensure that all students get their results (yes, moderated by the Department, Faculty and University) within 2 weeks after the last day of exams. This would be a significant improvement on the transparency (or lack thereof) of the marking process of finals already, and it serves much of the purpose for which many of us want to know the answers in the first place. Therefore, even without bell curve system, not everyone would obtain first honour in the same time. That was the thinking many years ago, and things may have changed. #3: Thanks, Kim, for the nice story about the Economics professor. #22: To NUS Graduate: I might do more disservice should I give everyone a CAP of 5! Spam protection has stopped this request. 1) From my experience, there exists some “kiasu” students who are rather marks-oriented, who will attempt to “squeeze” out more marks (as much as possible) from the examiner. 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